Right to know more?

No I’m not back to regular posting yet but I thought I’d better start a new thread and decided to throw out a question that I’ve been wrestling with myself over the past few days.

That is, do Canadians have a right to know more about Jack Layton’s health problems now that he is the leader of the Official Opposition (even though the party now has an interim leader)?

Comments will be moderated.

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95 Responses to Right to know more?

  1. Mary T says:

    One look at him last Monday told the story, and his voice finished it. Those of us who have watched a close friend or family member go thru this can see the signs. He had hip surgery, but no reports of him ever falling. In most cases, other than a serious accident, your hip breaks then you fall.
    I think we do need to know the truth.
    He is not helping by not announcing a leadership contest and his resignation when that is over. That new leader will have a couple of years to put his/her mark on the party before the next election. I think Bob Rae will try to take over the opposition, even if he is leader of the 3rd party. Or he will work to merge with the ndp, and run as leader.
    Regardless, Jack will never be back as an effective leader, regardless of the spin by ndpers and the media.

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      Those of us who have watched a close friend or family member go thru this can see the signs

      That’s for sure. I saw and heard my grandfather when Layton gave that press conference.

      Like

  2. jon says:

    As long as he remains a public official then, yeah, his health is relevant to us all. But the media, too, needs to behave responsibly and not pursue the matter with zeal. There’s no need to, anyway. He’s receiving cancer treatment, we know that…. no need for daily updates and the pursuit of them by the media, though. But that won’t stop them.

    Like

  3. Rob C says:

    Jack has taken a leave of absence. If I take a leave of absence I don’t get payed, who is paying Jack? The taxpayers, or is their a disability plan payed for by HIM?

    Like

  4. Bubba Brown says:

    I don’t think we heard the whole story from the git-go.
    I have also seen loved ones down that trail, it is not an easy one.
    I think Jack should have put his health first some time ago, election campaigns are draining.
    The most important thing is to look after yourself , everything else is third after health and family.
    I hope he finds some peace, he looked terrible.
    With all those newbies and a rookie “interim” leader it ain’t gonna be pretty.
    The NDP made their first serious error with their filibuster, now a veteran public service union type as a leader?
    I was told by someone who was there, that the sweetest thing was the “Vote” after all the drama.
    Filabuster meet MAJORITY.
    By the by Joanne feels like old times, good times Cheers!

    Like

  5. Maggie says:

    The media in Canada have their own biases remember? They decided not to mention
    Barbara Frum’s illness until she died neither was much made of Peter Gzowsky’s illness.

    I am happy for people to have their privacy I just wish the media were consistent.

    Like

  6. Fay says:

    I totally agree with Mary T.
    jack layton’s fate is in God’s hands now.

    Like

  7. fh says:

    I think Jack Layton was brave to hold the news conference and tell Canadians that he has a new cancer.
    most Canadians know a person who has cancer or who has died from cancer
    I wish him courage and pray for him and his family
    we need to be respectful of his need for privacy
    I do not support the NDP or their policies
    fh

    Like

  8. Joanne says:

    So Mulcair once considered joining the CPC. I’m glad that didn’t work out!

    Like

  9. fh says:

    off topic
    headline ctv “Should feds be on the hook for the costs of smoking?”
    NO! NO! NO!
    “feds” are TAXPAYERS we are already on the hook remember healthcare this is
    before the court and court expected to rule soon

    Like

  10. frmgrl says:

    I must say when I saw that news conference, I was shocked at how Jack looked and his voice that’s what was most shocking and telling. Yes as we do need to know the state of the health of our leaders. How much detail that is the question?
    In the US, leaders have to release their medical records. I don’t know we need to go that far but we do need somewhat of a sense of their health because the state of one’s health has a bearing on judgement and judgement is important in governance and leadership especially if one is taking certain medications that could have an affect on judgement.
    In any case, even though we may not all agree with Jack’s politics,we all need to keep Jack,Olivia and family in our hearts and prayers at this time.

    Like

  11. IMHO, once Jack Layton stepped aside as leader of the official opposition we lost any right/need to know the details of his illness. Once/if he returns to lead his party, we regain the right to be informed about the details of his health. Otherwise, his right to privacy trumps our curiosity.

    Nice to see you posting again, Joanne.

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      Thanks Russ. I’m not officially back yet, but maybe easing myself into it. 😉

      Still lots of background stuff to do here. Since the last server change there have been some issues that I’m still pondering.

      Like

  12. Mary T says:

    I doubt that the PM approached Mulcair, as Nycole spins. Probably the other way around and was told to go fly a kite. Could explain his hatred for the PM-you know the old saying, a politician scorned.
    If Mulcair does not win the coming leadership campaign for the ndp, will he join the Bloc.

    Like

  13. Bubba Brown says:

    Things that make you go Hmmmm. there is a interesting story over at Russ Campbell blog re Muclair being head-hunted by the Tories.http://russ-campbell.blogspot.com/2011/07/on-rats-and-ratting.html
    Being of a somewhat cynical nature I kinda wonder who threw this nugget at a possible competitor?
    More importantly, will it stick?

    Like

  14. Dirt says:

    No I don’t believe the public has the right to know what kind of cancer it is, he’s entitled to his privacy-he’s on a leave of absense or sick leave thus leave him be. When I watched the press conference all I could think was “He’s at end stage cancer”, I hope not but if you’ve seen that look before you’ll know what I’m talking about.

    Like

  15. dmorris says:

    Layton has a right to privacy,NOW, before the election, we were lead to believe that the NDP was going to continue to be run by the man we knew and respected as an intelligent,canny politician. Layton is/was the face of the NDP, the star that made them a viable alternative, most people would be hard done to name another NDP MP, except perhaps the loathsome Libby Davies.

    If Layton knew his cancer was back BEFORE May 2,the public DID have a right to know. When you decide to vote for the Leader of a Party,as so many of us do, you have a right to know if that person is going to be around to guide the caucus, and live up to your hopes.

    One of my family members is an RN with many years experience working with cancer patients. She said,well before the election,that Layton’s cancer was back,and she doubted he’d be in politics much longer. When I next saw Layton on TV, I looked more closely,and she was right, he looked much like my Dad about six months before he died of prostrate cancer.

    I had naively argued with my relative that “surely he’d let the voters know if that was the case”.

    I hope the Doctors can minimize the pain as much as possible. I think that’s all that’s left.

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      If Layton knew his cancer was back BEFORE May 2,the public DID have a right to know.

      Well he said it was a different kind of cancer, but who knows? He seemed pretty energetic as the campaign went on, but apparently he started going downhill towards the end of the spring session of Parliament.

      Like

      • frmgrl says:

        This is what I think happened. Campaigns are grueling. You’re on the road 24/7 for five weeks. Not getting much sleep, your eating is erratic. It’s high stress. He had that hip surgery two weeks before and was just beginning to recover when the election started. What kept him going during the campaign was adrenaline when the “orange crush” started right after the debates. It seemed to energize him giving him a high. That adrenaline sustained him until after the election when everything settled down then it hit him. Now his health seems worse.

        Like

  16. Gabby in QC says:

    Should details about any politician’s health problems be made public? IMO, no.

    Jack Layton announced he was battling prostate cancer. He has now said he’s fighting another cancer. Would knowing what kind of cancer he’s battling add anything to the public sphere? Yeah, maybe some journalists could squeeze a few articles out of it, “researching” the type of cancer, some statistics of survival rates, famous people who survived or succumbed to the same disease, etc. But what does it add to the general public? IMO, nothing.

    Being a public figure doesn’t mean the public and the MSM owns every aspect of your life. I’m for allowing the man/woman the dignity of dealing with it as (s)he wishes, publicly or privately.

    Like

  17. Mary T says:

    I agree we have no right to know what kind of cancer he has, but voters who voted ndp because of him, and that is the only reason, they had a right to know. As has been mentioned, he is a very sick man.
    Wonder if his wife will step down when he does.

    Like

  18. Liz J says:

    Hi Joanne, hope you’re having a restful summer with your family and gearing up for the Fall excitement in Ontario. I’m ready as I continue digging up a variety of McGuintys from our lawn throughout the summer.

    As for Jack Layton, let him be, God bless him and give him all the strength he can muster to deal with a horrible disease.

    Like

  19. Sandy says:

    Hi Joanne — I am gradually working my way back too. In my case it the Muslim prayer issue in the Toronto school.

    Anyway, re Jack Layton. I agree with everyone that he has our best wishes and prayers for a speedy recovery — assuming that is even possible.

    However, one issue does bother me and that is the fawning in the media, particularly the CBC. They keep calling the NDP, the government in waiting! Huh? Beyond Quebec, they won just a few more seats. On top of that, they are calling Layton’s temporary replacement a heroine. Pardon me?

    Look, I don’t want to be paranoid but I get the feeling the main networks (apart from SNN) are trying to soften up Canadians to an NDP government in four years time. Not going to happen but it does show that, while four years is a long time, we can’t take anything for granted.

    Remember Jo, if you need any help, just ask. WordPress.com has improved to the point now that I would not consider going to a WordPress.org private server.

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      Hi Sandy! Good to hear from you. I hope your summer is going well.

      Thanks for the offer of assistance. Yes I hear you about the advantages of wp.com vs .org. Still pondering what to do going forward but I am looking for stability and .com may be the answer.

      Like

    • Jen says:

      I get the feeling the main networks (apart from SNN) are trying to soften up Canadians to an NDP government in four years time.

      Your feelings are very real because I notice the same thing. What the NDP stand for (in the eyes of the media) is beside the point…..just as long it is anybody or any party instead of the conservatives. I notice that the media treat Layton as if he is the PM.
      In other words, in the eyes of the world stephen harper is the prime minister but in the eyes of the msm in canada, Jack Layton, Bob Rae or for that matter, Elizabeth Rae are viewed superior to the PM.

      How idiotic of CBC to say that they need proof before disclosing names of the suspect yet the proof of STEPHEN HARPER as PM is not acceptable.

      Like

  20. Sandy says:

    By the way, your “comment notification plugin” is not activated which means everyone has to continually come back to read new comments –rather than get an e-mail. That is an easy one if you want me to take care of it.

    Like

  21. Sandy says:

    That’s strange. My first comment went into moderation but not my second.

    Like

  22. Sandy says:

    Well, delete those last couple of comments because moderation came on after the fact.

    Like

  23. Bec says:

    Well, I do want to know what his cancer has metastasized to, not because I want the gossip aspect but the information.

    I watched a neighbour, at the same age have the same thing occur (presumption on my part) and it did in fact kill him very slowly and painfully for his family. 60 ish is huge for prostate cancer and does create this exact scenario, many times.

    I believe that Jack could be a tool to educate but I also respect his right to a private time during the treatment. So, do I want to know? Yes. Do I have a right to know? No.

    Like

  24. Liz J says:

    Sandy, funny, I wondered how you would react to the Muslim prayer room in the Public Schools.
    Look forward to some good discussion, it’s more widespread than we know, several schools in Ottawa already have made accommodations.

    Like

  25. Bec says:

    And here in Calgary, Liz J.
    An entire school that they felt they deserved more to accomodate the PARENTS ( not the kids choice) that lined up.

    I have no problem with what we are doing with Charter and Private Schools in Calgary/AB but they need to be treated as something other than “Public” and the situation that I reference, was a gong show.

    Like

  26. Norm says:

    I think what the NDP did was dishonest. They ran the entire campaign emphasizing Jack, Jack, Jack and I think both he and the NDP knew full well Jack wasn’t going to be leader for much longer. He won’t be back.

    As for Joanne, please come back:)

    Like

  27. Sandy says:

    Some technical stuff.

    If you decide on .com, don’t forget to save/export a copy of your database for this site on .org.

    Simply go to “Tools.” Click on “export” and then when it comes up as a file on your harddrive, click save. At the end of saving, you’ll see how many MG bites your directory is — too big for an ordinary import to the .com server, but I have a feeling someone at “support” may know how to do it.

    Without the import directory, you would be starting from scratch but I don’t suppose anyone here minds that idea because there will not be a limit once you get going. It is only the “import” component.

    One thing for your in-house site manager. Before you try to buy the domain upgrade at .com, change the name servers for bluelikeyou.com as follows: NS1.WORDPRESS.COM, NS2.WORDPRESS.COM and NS3.WORDPRESS.COM.

    Then, give it a few hours or a day and then click on the “domain” upgrade. It will then recognize your domain and it is but a payment click away from completion. Then, go to the very top of the dashboard left side bar and you will see “Domain.” Click on that and then make bluelikeyou.com your primary domain and viola, your posts will automatically go on the BT aggregator.

    I am no longer on BT, so regulars will have to visit me directly.

    LOL. I probably should have e-mailed you. Everyones eyes will be glassed over by now!

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      Ah thanks Sandy. That’s the stuff that puts me off blogging though. But at least readers may have an idea why it gets so frustrating.

      Like

  28. batb says:

    Joanne, if this was a “routine” health problem, I’d say that Canadians should be told the full extent of the problem.

    However, and I hesitate to say this “out loud”: It appears that Mr. Layton may be dying. If this is the case, I think that his family should have the time and the space to deal with this dire situation, without public scrutiny. As others have pointed out, it really looks like Jack Layton is in God’s hands now.

    ‘Good to “hear” from you mid-summer! Every blessing to you and your family.

    Like

  29. Sandy says:

    Joanne — I hear ya. No biggy to get set up. You already have the .com temporary site anyway. One thing that is especially positive about .com is that you don’t have to worry about plugins. Whatever they have are automatic as everyone has the same options, apart from themes. Plus, the biggest plus for .com is when you have a problem. All you have to do is go to “Support” and send an e-mail inquiry with your problem and they respond very quickly. The company is called Automattic and their employees are all around the world, working in their virtual world. They call the support workers “Happiness Engineers.” I love it!

    Have a good rest of the summer everyone!

    Like

  30. Bubba Brown says:

    Norm @ 8:24 I concur, I think the Canadian voters were played.
    The realization after the coup attempt that Jack would do anything to get to power.
    I sympathize with him and his family in his illness, I have no such sympathy with his shenanigans.
    I do however have an obligation to my own family, to Canada, my grand kids, which transcends any other.
    Best take on the institutionalized socialism that is the NDP, which would have put the Bloc firmly in control of our Country in exchange for a few cabinet seats is from Machiavelli: read the comments.
    http://www.bloggingtories.ca/forums/post96304.html

    Like

  31. Liz J says:

    Does anyone else feel it would be more important that the public know more about the state of Jack Layton’s health if he were the leader of the Official Opposition in a Minority government situation? I shudder to think what would befall the country if that were the case in the present situation in the NDP.

    If Jack can’t make it back, there could be quite a lot of turmoil within the NDP and we’ll have a dysfunctional official Opposition.

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      Does anyone else feel it would be more important that the public know more about the state of Jack Layton’s health if he were the leader of the Official Opposition in a Minority government situation?

      This article addresses that thought:

      First, he’s not prime minister, so he isn’t making critical decisions about the course of the country, Sallot says. Second, the country won’t be heading back to the polls for at least four years, so nobody has to decide now whether Layton is physically able to be prime minister.

      Like

  32. Mary T says:

    Thank the voters for giving PMSH a majority last May. Jack was behind the coup attempt, he offered the Bloc veto power over all legislation. He pretended he had nothing to do with it. He hid his health problems from the voters during the campaign, as he knew Que separtists would vote for Jack, not the NDP. They were sure there would be another minority and he (they) would be PM by Christmas.
    Nycole will not be able to give Que what it wants and keep his western base.
    Sorry to be so blunt. The sooner the ndp accept the fact Jack will never be back as OLO, the better off for them. Two interim leaders in Sept, fighting for the spotlight should make QP very boring.
    We can assume that whatever bills are brought fwd, and passed, the media will say, the PM is taking advantage of Jack’s illness.
    Nobody likes to admit they voted wrong, so I doubt the ndp will lose a lot of seats back to the liberals, but those sitting on the fence in the rest of Canada might give up on the ndp and vote liberal again. Rae can only hope.
    One thing for certain, the PM will not be facing a PM in waiting for the next few years. And going into the next election with 2 untried leaders will be fun to watch.

    Like

  33. Richco says:

    Leave Layton alone. Too many are quick to be writing Jack’s obituary when respect and privacy should be afforded him. It is in no one’s interest for him or any other politician to disclose health issues.

    “I don’t think we should expect anyone who is sick – famous or unknown, young or old, married or single – to be heroic, or an example to others.

    I think we should expect them to be human, and start from there.”

    http://www.torontosun.com/2011/07/28/cancer-has-no-heroes

    Like

  34. Swill says:

    Not sure which reporter it was, Robert Fyfe (he’s not really a reporter) I think said he saw Jack a month ago and he looked fine. My guess is that it is pancreatic cancer because of the weight loss. If his reporting is true on the timing then it is not good for Jack.
    Do not like his politics, but he was entertaining acting like the man for the little guy.

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      I was thinking pancreatic cancer too. He looked just like my grandfather before he passed way. I hope we’re wrong though.

      Like

  35. Sandy says:

    Whoa! Richco, your comment is extremely judgmental and sure shut down the discussion here. And in fact, even calls into question the whole reason for Joanne’s post in the first place.

    She asked: “Do Canadians have a right to know more about Layton’s health now that he is leader of the Official Opposition?”

    Some will say “yes,” others will say “no.” And, such is the essence of a democracy!

    You write:

    (1) “Leave Layton alone. Too many are quick to be writing Jack’s obituary when respect and privacy should be afforded him. It is in no one’s interest for him or any other politician to disclose health issues. “

    We live in a free country and Layton chose to be a public figure, someone who has been saying, for five, years, that he wanted to be Prime Minister. Stock markets and the Canadian dollar can rise or fall on the basis of a political leaders health, including that of the leader of the Official Opposition. So, answering Joanne’s apolitical question is very much in our interest.

    While some, like you, will say his health issues are no ones business, others like me will say they are because they can have an effect on our country’s economic well being.

    Why? Because, as much as I am glad we have a Conservative majority, they must be kept on their toes and the only way for that to happen is for our country to have a strong Official Opposition and a strong OO leader. So, clearly if we knew what kind of cancer Layton was now fighting, we would have a better idea of whether or not he can recover.

    Moreover, no one is writing his obituary. But, he looked very very ill at his press conference. So, it is pure political correctness to suggest no one even say the unthinkable.

    (2) “I don’t think we should expect anyone who is sick – famous or unknown, young or old, married or single – to be heroic, or an example to others.”

    Maybe we shouldn’t expect anyone to be a hero or heroine, but they become one by their own behaviour anyway. In other words, it is human nature to look up to people who seem strong in the face of adversity. Think Terry Fox. Think Pope Jean Paul.

    Think also Dr. Marla Shapiro of CTV who had to suffer breast cancer and its treatment while still being on TV. In fact, she became a heroine to me when she went “live” with her bald head and looking frail and weak. That must surely have taken guts and I am told that it gave other patients suffering the same disease, hope to go on, particularly when she recovered!

    So, no I don’t think the majority of people “expect” people to be heros or heroines, it just happens — meaning that even out of tragedy, good can happen.

    (3) “I think we should expect them to be human, and start from there.”

    I am not sure what that statement is supposed to mean, apart from the possibility that you think some are considering Layton superhuman. I didn’t read any comments here that suggested that, quite the contrary actually.

    We all know how very human Layton is — running in an election campaign when he was recovering from both prostate cancer and hip surgery — but that was his decision to make.

    Even now, as sick as he is, he is expecting to get back into politics as opposed to retiring because that drive is what keeps him moving forward.

    ****

    A blog is a personal journal. Bloggers write what interests them or when they are looking for answers to questions. The question Joanne raised here (and no I have not been in contact with her over this) was genuine. If you don’t agree with it, by all means write about your disagreement, but in such a way that it does not throw ice water on the entire discussion.

    Hang in there Joanne.

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      Thanks Sandy. I think Richco was quoting Lorrie Goldstein for some of that but I’ll tell you this. A lot of what puts me off blogging is worrying about whose feelings are hurt by whom and is everyone trying to get along. It does get wearying.

      Like

    • Richco says:

      It’s my opinion Sandy. I’m judging no one. In fact, YOU have judged me quite nicely.

      “your comment is extremely judgmental and sure shut down the discussion here. And in fact, even calls into question the whole reason for Joanne’s post in the first place.”

      It does not.

      Joanne – you’re right – the quotes were Lorrie’s.

      My opinion and I feel strongly about it – “Too many are quick to be writing Jack’s obituary when respect and privacy should be afforded him. It is in no one’s interest for him or any other politician to disclose health issues.”

      Gabby wrote “Being a public figure doesn’t mean the public and the MSM owns every aspect of your life. I’m for allowing the man/woman the dignity of dealing with it as (s)he wishes, publicly or privately.”

      Why no passing of your judgement on Gabby, Sandy?

      Liz “As for Jack Layton, let him be, God bless him and give him all the strength he can muster to deal with a horrible disease.”

      How about Liz’s post Sandy.

      Sandy chimes in “Whoa! Richco, your comment is extremely judgmental and sure shut down the discussion here. And in fact, even calls into question the whole reason for Joanne’s post in the first place.”

      Your opinion, and wrong in the assumptions you are making. Perhaps Joanne decided to stop comments? And in no way have I called in to question Joanne’s reason for posting her post.

      “That is, do Canadians have a right to know more about Jack Layton’s health problems now that he is the leader of the Official Opposition (even though the party now has an interim leader)?”

      That was Joanne’s question. Did she expect everyone to be singing from the same song sheet or did she really want the opinion of visitors to her blog?

      Like

  36. jad says:

    I think one of the problems here is the usual double standard from the media. It was apparently OK several months ago for “respected” journalists to write innuendo pieces about the state of the PM’s marriage, but somehow describing how Layton had to sit in a garden chair for most of his garden party is off-limits.

    Like it or not, the NDP is the “government in waiting”, and Layton was therefore the “PM in waiting”. Sure, there won’t be an election for 4 years, but that doesn’t make the LOO totally irrelevant. I think the public deserves to know the broad outlines of a politician’s illness, but certainly not the day-to-day stuff. Unfortunately, with some kinds of cancer being more invasive than others, I think that also includes knowing what kind of cancer is involved here.

    The media clearly appear to have been protecting Layton up until the presser, and now, when they should be giving him some privacy to deal with his condition, they are all over the story with their useless speculation.

    Glad to see you’re spending time working on your blog, Joanne, and not just lazing around all summer 🙂

    Like

  37. batb says:

    Gosh, it’s hard to know whether Richco shut down the conversation or if it’s just been too hot to sit by the computer!

    As for your comment, Joanne: “A lot of what puts me off blogging is worrying about whose feelings are hurt by whom and is everyone trying to get along. It does get wearying.”

    You sound like a mom — and a grandmom! You’ll notice that Kate McMillan over at SDA doesn’t concern herself with whether or not her commenters are getting along — or hurting each others’ feelings. We’re all grown ups and should be able to take our lumps if someone says something we might find offensive.

    You give your commenters freedom to exchange ideas. Leave it to individuals to deal with their own hurt feelings. You shouldn’t be having to worry about how we’re getting along, as kind of you as that is!

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      You sound like a mom — and a grandmom! You’ll notice that Kate McMillan over at SDA doesn’t concern herself with whether or not her commenters are getting along — or hurting each others’ feelings.

      That brought a smile to my face Batb. One of her regulars went after me a while back and I thought ‘who needs this’? But you’re right, we’re all adults.

      So if you don’t like the heat get out of the kitchen right?

      Like

    • Richco says:

      very well written batb. I agree with you.

      Like

  38. batb says:

    So if you don’t like the heat get out of the kitchen right?

    Ya got it, Joanne! 😉

    Like

  39. Sandy says:

    For those who are interested, I just published a rather controversial post on who is really responsible for education reform — not teachers, not the teachers’ unions and not faculties of education. Rather, the governing political party in each province and territory!

    And, with so many provincial elections this fall (NFLD, PEI, ON, MAN, SASK and NWT), the public has to start putting the politicians’ feet to the fire.

    So, go get em.

    http://crux-of-the-matter.com/2011/07/31/teacher-faculty-of-ed-union-bashing-will-not-improve-public-education/

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      Glad to see you’re blogging again Sandy!

      My personal hope is that Tim Hudak stays as afar away as possible from education this election, and concentrates on pocketbook issues instead.

      Like

      • Liz J says:

        Agreed and the Liberals may try to draw him into it if they’re given opportunity , they’ve already tried the to get him on one of the last vestiges of the Liberals in desperation, Abortion.

        Like

        • Joanne says:

          Right. Hudak has to stay very focused on the economy.

          Like

          • Liz J says:

            The economy is key to everything that affects us day to day and long term.
            Hudak should link it to all questions from Health to Education, that way he will have the upper hand on the Liberals who are masters of sneaky politics. Betcha Warren and his elves have a Hail Mary pass or two ready to pounce.

            The NDP may be trying to play the Liberals at their own game, using the same tactics. Problem is the NDP are not too swift when it comes to economics. Their idea of taxing to death the engines that drive the economy, backing union demands for higher wages doesn’t work, money doesn’t come from the sky.

            Like

      • Richco says:

        he may not have a choice in a few weeks Joanne. The NDP have purposely held back presenting their education platform – rumour is circulating that it contains a bombshell.

        Also, on the prayer in schools issue both Hudak and McGuinty dropped a very important ball. It’s all up on Sandy’s blog – who, by the way came back to the blogging fray when that issue hit the fan.

        If you’re looking for the latest poll data on the Ont. election see this resource http://www.electionprediction.org/2011_on/index.php

        I think the result is going to surprise us all.

        Like

        • Joanne says:

          Also, on the prayer in schools issue both Hudak and McGuinty dropped a very important ball.

          In theory I agree that it should be discussed. But from a tactical POV I think Hukak should simply say that it’s not their primary focus right now.

          Like

          • Richco says:

            That would have been better then what he did say Joanne.

            Both McGuinty and Hudak have the same take on it – leave it up to the school boards to decide for themselves. They’ve opened the flood gates and truthfully stole a plank from John Tory’s FB schools platform.

            It’s not going away any time soon.

            We’ll see what happens in the last two weeks of August which is when the teacher union AGMs are as to what the NDP are going to propose.

            Like

          • Joanne says:

            Both McGuinty and Hudak have the same take on it – leave it up to the school boards to decide for themselves.

            Well if I were going to pursue the issue I would want to know exactly what the law is on such things. There are several issues involved but the one that bothers me the most is the tacit approval of Sharia law in some public schools where the population is mainly Muslim. Why do we allow females to be second-class citizens in these situations?

            Like

          • Joanne says:

            (But again, I don’t see this as an election issue – maybe more of one for the courts.)

            Like

          • jon says:

            Richco, for Hudak to stake out a different opinion would most certainly be used by the MSM to attack Hudak, to say he is being “Islamaphobic”. You know it and I know it. That’s the way it would be played.

            The last thing the Toronto-centered media wants is to be swept in 3 straight games, having conservatives at every level of gov’t. They’re really desperate.

            Best thing is for Hudak to neutralize not just McGuinty but the MSM as well on the issue. While in no way to the religious schools funding issue that plagued John Tory, it would be played in a similar way — that a social-conservative Hudak has a nasty hidden social agenda.

            Keeping the focus on the economy is wise for Hudak — what the media certainly doesn’t want the election to be about. And just as important as the strategy against your political opponent, so to is the one to be used against the MSM…. Ford and PMSH played the media like fiddles; Hudak needs to do the same.

            Like

          • Joanne says:

            Jon, I concur 100%.

            Like

  40. Mary T says:

    Any one catch nycole and libby at the pride parade in BC. Why does she always say she is bilingual and they have a great team. A couple of people interviewed said she had a lot of work to do, she is not Jack.

    Like

  41. Liz J says:

    Monte Solberg in the Ottawa Sun today: “Canadians like Jack, even if they don’t like his politics” kind of puts things in perspective.

    Jack may be a political animal but this fight is beyond politics. I’m thinking some public figures might find it helpful to share their struggle with this disease, some may not. With his last appearance, Jack Layton shared just how seriously ill he is.

    Like

  42. Mary T says:

    Pancreatic Cancer is horrible and swift. Lost a friend today, age 60 next birthday, from it and she was diagnosed 2 months ago. What a shock.

    Like

  43. Richco says:

    jon – (Joanne – I’m posting down here because there is no “reply” option under jon’s post)

    I hear what you’re saying but I don’t agree. From an educational leadership perspective what both Hudak and McGuinty did was pass the buck on this issue off to the school boards. They’re both fearing the same thing.

    Re: thanks to this issue and that we’re learning about more and more schools and boards which have been hosting prayer sessions in the schools, even if the fb issue were raised again this time, Dalton’s on board with it and can’t spin it as he once did.
    They can try but it’s not going to have the impact it did last time.

    I don’t believe we’ve heard the last of this, and both McGuinty and Hudak will have to do better than pass the buck before election day.

    Oddly enough in my riding McGuinty will lose the election on green energy and hydro alone – but last week an education issue is now front and centre with our region being thrust into an unwanted accommodation review in September, which is really going to have passions high against a potential school closure. Stay tuned.

    Oh, and at the PC AGM this past spring education was the 2nd issue, behind the green energy cock-up that concerns our riding.

    Also, the Liberals are getting a free ride here. No opposition to challenge that I can tell, yet people are asking about who the PC is and IF the NDP even have a candidate.

    Like

  44. Liz J says:

    The McGuinty Liberals didn’t deserve a second majority after they broke so many “promises” made for the first one. The second term is no better and we are in a fiscal mess which they refuse to call bankruptcy or admit to being in have-not status.

    We all know they’ll try to find that one biggie to win the next one. They’ll be putting out traps hoping Hudak will fall into at least one.
    They figure all they need is one trick for their pony Kinsella to ride them to victory.

    Lets concentrate on the phrase,”it’s the economy stupid” to put everything else in perspective.

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      Lets concentrate on the phrase,”it’s the economy stupid” to put everything else in perspective.

      Yup. Let’s keep it simple and stick to the main issues. That’s my feeling.

      Like

  45. Pingback: Economy & Energy prime election issues | Blue Like You

  46. Liz J says:

    Wonder why the media isn’t making an issue of the fact acting leader of the NDP,Madam Turmel, canceled her Bloc membership just before she joined the NDP, saying she was leaving for personal reasons, she still believes in their policies?

    So do we have a person leading the Official Opposition who espouses the breakup of the country which was their raison d’etre from day one ?

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      I think the bigger issue is why did Jack Layton recommend her as interim leader?

      Like

      • Liz J says:

        Why did he indeed.

        Did he not know of her long term membership in the Bloc and her membership in a provincial separatist party as well? If he did could he not see what damage this might do to his party beyond Quebec borders?

        Perhaps he has too many keeners at his back looking to take on his job and he doesn’t trust them. Why else would he hand his party over to a greenhorn politician who has no experience in the political arena?

        Of course the fact she was a union head might just qualify her to lead the NDP if they still want to consider themselves just a labour movement. I think they’re in a real mess and there might be an implosion. At least with the Bloc we knew what we were dealing with.

        Maybe we should give her a break, after all didn’t our esteemed story writer, Maggie Atwood say she’d vote Bloc if she lived in Quebec?

        Like

        • Joanne says:

          Perhaps he has too many keeners at his back looking to take on his job and he doesn’t trust them. Why else would he hand his party over to a greenhorn politician who has no experience in the political arena?

          I’m sure part of it is that Layton didn’t want to show any preference for possible future leadership contenders. But the other problematic thing is that his choice panders to the Quebec influence (not to mention the cozying up to the separatist movement.) I bet some of his caucus from other parts of the country are not at all impressed.

          Like

  47. Pingback: Economy & Energy prime election issues | Blue Like You2

  48. Bubba Brown says:

    Lets see what we got here under this rock…….ewww ! So a card carrying Separatist, supporter of the Bloc and Quebec Solidare.
    This woman who insists she did not “inhale”
    Her letter quitting the Bloc stated that her quitting “had nothing to do with the party’s policies”
    Her support of Quebec Solidare merely a “gesture of support for a friend” The lone MNA for this group is the charming fellow who called Kate and William “Parasites”.
    He spends his free time picketing shoe stores that have made the grievous error, in his opinion, of selling shoes made in Israel.
    Gee she makes Libby and Muclair seem balanced, statesman/woman like in comparison.
    People can of course change their minds and affiliations, this is way beyond that.
    This is a fairy tale of a “conversion on the road to Baghdad-on-the-Rideau” which is the biggest howler I have seen since Iggys ” poor humble peasant roots” fable.
    N.D.P.+Bloc+ Solidare who knew?
    Here I thought we were in for a quiet, productive 4 or 5 years with little of the drama.

    Like

  49. Liz J says:

    Christie Blatchford has a great comment column in the National Post today: “Simple answers not for the NDP”.

    How can we trust any information from them on anything when they fiddle with the truth until it’s far from it?

    As things are unfolding for the NDP, the Liberals will be salivating.

    Like

  50. Liz J says:

    I’m left wondering whether the NDP are really idiots or they think we are, it can’t be both.

    Like

  51. Richco says:

    consider the source of this column as you read it folks. This is another sign that the McGuinty Liberals are grasping at any thing that moves in desperation.

    http://www.thestar.com/article/1034700–tim-harper-fishing-buddies-wednesday-gone-by-thursday

    I have to say though that if people who attended this event were taped/video and unaware that they were and found themselves on YouTube – I’d be pissed too.

    From a few of my friends who attended this event it was light and humourous and all in fun. Leave it to the Star and the Liberals to take a backyard summer BBQ and turn it into an election issue.

    Not going to happen.

    Like

    • jon says:

      “It’s not politically smart, nor particularly productive, to take on a sitting premier on the eve of an election campaign in the country’s largest province. If McGuinty really can capitalize on a Ford backlash, Harper just gave him a helping hand.”

      Chalk that one up to delusional, wishful thinking, which the Media Party, led by the Star in many instances, engage in every election cycle, confusing it with objective analysis…. So sad to watch those in the Media Party actually thinking they can impart their own biases onto the voting public and hoping, as a result, to influence the election results.

      They’re gluttons for punishment apparently, and love getting slapped around.

      Like

  52. Gabby in QC says:

    Re: that video of the Ford BBQ on YouTube & promptly removed …

    From the TorStar column:
    « “We were surprised that someone would do that,” said one senior Conservative who attended.
    “You would like to think that when people come to these events, they come with the best intentions and motives.” »

    Presumably those attending were conservatives, so they should have known better than to upload it to YouTube. Don’t they realize that the MSM is always looking to make hay out of the most innocuous comments of politicians? Regardless of how innocent some politicians’ comments may be, there’s always some critic ready to misrepresent words and actions, so it’s up to politicians and their entourage to be guarded at all times. Sad, but that’s the kind of world we now live in.

    Like

    • Joanne says:

      I saw the video and I don’t see any problem with it but you’re right Gabby about the media ready to pounce on anything.

      Like

      • Liz J says:

        Absolutely, they’re desperate and will be ready to make something of some Conservative passing the time of day.

        If Mr Kinsella is their manure spreader he’s really going to have a tough time to find a ticket to ride this time around. As in the Federal and the Municipal election in Toronto, the people are onto them.

        Like

  53. Bubba Brown says:

    “It’s not politically smart nor particularly productive……”
    Reminds me of old Craig Oliver intoning in his best anchorman “voice of doom”
    That (HMPM) Harper might well have “lost his chance for a majority” because a couple of Liberal plants were refused entry to a private Conservative function.
    Gee Craig you sure nailed that one /sarc/off.
    Desperation in the final days folks…. Hat trick coming up…..
    Liberals practice saying …. want fries with that Mister?
    Meanwhile NDP’ers suffer “seperation anxiety”
    Perhaps a tube (Costco size) of “Seperation H” will help those A**holes.

    Like

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